"I´d not prolongued the chewing up, Doc. Nor the being spat out. Not go out a cunt. It´s the dispatch I find inglorious. The whole delusory fucking self importance.". Al Swedgin ;).
And now this show is as good as True Blood. Take that any way you want.
why? what happened?
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"I´d not prolongued the chewing up, Doc. Nor the being spat out. Not go out a cunt. It´s the dispatch I find inglorious. The whole delusory fucking self importance.". Al Swedgin ;).
Well IMO this episode did many good things and nothing wrong, and yet overall it was sort of meh for me. Kinda like episode 2, in a way. Still had great moments. If I would have been a Dany fan, I would have definitely loved the ending (although seriously? 90% of it was already in the trailers). However, since I'm not, I was expecting the highlight of the episode for me to be the Old Bear's death, and I was a bit upset we didn't get a last close-up or a proper send-off moment with Sam or Grenn or even Edd. The lack of it and the stabbing made the scene even more brutal. Theon killed me. I was not expecting that dialogue. Sadistic janitor is sadistic. Go and die in a worm hole! NCW was amazing as well. No words needed. Every scene with him and G. Christie is gold. Jaime reaching his sword with his right hand stump was...ugh. THE PAIN! Bran's scene was pointless and felt like a bad editing choice, it was like it was taken from a whole different episode. But the KL scenes were very well done, especially the Sept of Baelor. Jack Gleeson is...wow. Just wow. And I loved Margaery's comment about the pig nose. BWAHAHA! So many winks to the fans this season.
PS: THANK YOU! Someone finally commented on the Tyrell sigil and words.
-- Edited by Macha on Monday 22nd of April 2013 07:10:22 AM
Well, glad to see that Tywin disdains all three of his children. Finally had the alone time with Cersei, just like with the two other children. Wouldn't want to think of her as Daddy's little princess, now would we?
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"There's no cure for being a cunt." Bronn "King Stannis is my god." Davos "Who the fuck is Jon Snow?" Locke
Oh, and even though I was expecting the scene with ; I was totally blown away by how they portrayed it. Freaking awesome it was. Now... to make my :dracarys: animated emoticon...
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"There's no cure for being a cunt." Bronn "King Stannis is my god." Davos "Who the fuck is Jon Snow?" Locke
Burn Gorman, a fabulous actor playing "Hey who the fuck is this random unnamed Night's Watchman who is just here to stir up trouble and piss the Lord Commander and Craster off and Mormont doesn't even know his name."
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"There's no cure for being a cunt." Bronn "King Stannis is my god." Davos "Who the fuck is Jon Snow?" Locke
Overall I am liking this season so much more than S2, the buzz I got off this one was palpable with some scenes being *identical* to how I read em in the book.
How anyone has been able to translate the written word to something, visual and palpable using people, costumes, props, camera angles and effects, is a miracle. Maybe I say it because I am sorta in the business, but when it does occur its magical...and that's just my opinion.
I will re-watch and do a full write up.
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"Robert was never the same after he put on that crown. Some men are like swords, made for fighting. Hang them up and they go to rust.” -DN
"I´d not prolongued the chewing up, Doc. Nor the being spat out. Not go out a cunt. It´s the dispatch I find inglorious. The whole delusory fucking self importance.". Al Swedgin ;).
Jaime…my poor Jaime. He doesn’t seem as amused by having his severed body parts dangling from his neck as Davos was.
Haha! Good one, Basi! I didn't think of that parallelism.
--
I'm too afraid of spoiling something to comment in this thread so I'm just going to share Mr. Tir's impressions. He watched it last night and liked it, but was not "gee wizzed". He gave it 3/5, and complained about the pace. (For reference, he thought last episode was 11/10, it was one of his favourite episodes ever, more than Blackwater for example)
He was very underwhelmed by the whole Dracarys scene; he found it "very much like those movies where they try to tell you someone is a badass hero cause there's a lot of explosions behind them and they don't even turn around, they make beatifull slow motion shots of them turning their head into the sunshine and ramp up the music" but that he wasn't "feeling it", though he says it might be influenced by the fact he's "not in team Khaleesi, and doesn't buy into her as a leader", doesn't really care about dragons either, and the scene was so telegraphed that it had no surprise factor.
He was completely surprised by the death of Mormont. He squeeled, and turned to me in horror "they've killed commander Mormont? They've killed Mormont!!!! NOO!" He thought somehow they were gonna kill Craster but he didn't expect Mormont to die and this part of the episode was the most thrilling to him. His second favourite scene was Jaime and Brienne. He thinks that the loss of his hand and his identity is going to start a downwards spiral and turn him into a real villain, and said he's "glad that it wasn't Arya who run into those Bolton men".
He has always loved Theon and he feels for him the most, and he was compeltely pumped to find out why on earth his rescuer said "winter is coming". It was wrecking his brains all week. () He believed his speech in the woods about Saltpans and Balon and whatnot, but then on the corridor he said "this is a trap, Theon shut ur face and get out, it's a traaaaap".
He felt Bran's dream was just a filler but liked to be able to see him. He loves Bran's team and he suffers every episode he doesn't get a glimpse of them. He didn't like the Varys/Ros scene and the Varys/Tyrion scene (he finds the bit with the sourcerer unbelievable, he says there weren't any holes in the box and even if his mouth was sewn or his tongue was cut, he would still be able to make grunting noises), but he liked learning Varys' backstory and particularly how he learned that "the contents of men's letters were more valuable than those of their purses". He doesn't buy at all that Varys would care that much about Sansa, he thinks if anything, he would want to piss LF, but that LF cannot be a real threat to the North like Varys built him up to be. And that the Tyrells surely would have thought themselves about trying to gain more power by marrying Sansa to Loras. He liked the Cersei scenes and the Margaery scenes.
He loves the Hound more in every scene, and liked the exchange between him and the BwB, and he doesn't want either of them to die, but fears for the Hound on account of the FIRE theme going around there. But he doesn't want Beric to die either, he seems interesting and we just met him.He's also thrilled that we get to see other people from Mel's religion, and to see how they seem so "normal", but fears for Gendry.
-- Edited by Tir Airgid on Tuesday 23rd of April 2013 08:01:45 AM
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“Fear is a strange soil. It grows obedience like corn, which grow in straight lines to make weeding easier. But sometimes it grows the potatoes of defiance, which flourish underground.”
I liked this episode. Like last week’s, I was surprised when the credits started at the end. I was entranced. My preliminary thought as the episode began was that I wish they would show us some landmarks north of the wall in the opening credits. It would be nice to see where the Fist is. Or Craster’s Keep. It would be nice to feel more oriented about the geography north of the wall.
Jaime…my poor Jaime. He doesn’t seem as amused by having his severed body parts dangling from his neck as Davos was. The Boltons truly show their lack of basic humanity. Oh, and where did Brienne’s armor go? It’s not okay to take a lady’s armor.
Jaime’s awkward attempt to fight off the Bolton men was painful to watch. I’ve thought a lot this last week about what the loss of Jaime’s hand means for his future, assuming he lives long enough to have much of a future. His entire identity and self-worth were inextricably linked to his fighting skills, especially with a sword. And that identity was taken from him in a single moment of brutality. His statement “I was that hand,” summed it up perfectly. He’s grieving for a large part of his life that’s over. Brienne has it right, of course. This is his first encounter with the real world where he can’t fall back on his family name and fortune. And now he can’t rely on his talent with a blade either. He’s going to have to grow as a person and endure some hardship should he survive his brush with the Boltons. I love his character so much, I’m looking forward to watching his personal journey in the coming episodes. The revelation that Tarth didn’t have any sapphires shows the first step in that journey. I was touched. Adversity is so good for him.
Varys dominated this episode. It’s easy to think of him as a pragmatic, yet essentially good character. But when he talks about having the stomach for revenge, it's the first true hint of darkness from him. The first scene with Varys and Tyrion was impressive. Varys was intense as he busied himself at whatever he was doing. I believed he was only giving Tyrion advice about how to survive, so I was surprised by the sorcerer with his mouth stitched shut (I think that’s what I was seeing anyway.) I enjoyed his dialogue…his description of what happened to him and his resolve to live. And I wonder whether we’ll be seeing that potion that paralyzes you while leaving the rest of your senses intact. I can think of some characters I’d like to see that used on.
Varys and Ros discussing Podrick were funny. Not a great scene overall, but it was a light and amusing segue for the scene with Varys and Olenna Tyrell. I didn’t like the beginning of the scene where Olenna goes on and on about roses and their motto. It was a bit tiresome, and not nearly as sharp and witty as most of her dialogue. But the interaction between Varys and Olenna was fantastic. They both know exactly what the other is about. Varys plays his game so well, but he is entirely matched by Olenna’s has no advantage over Olenna. The scheming in this episode revealed an interesting contrast between the deft maneuvering of Varys and Olenna and Cersei’s clumsy ploys to manipulate her father. She is truly out of her league compared to the Tyrells and Varys. The Tyrells have been the best part of this season thus far. What I wonder about most is whether they are truly the decent people they appear to be. They're almost like Starks with pragmatism. Surely that can't be correct. So I'm waiting for their true colors to show themselves.
The idea of using Loras to ensure that Sansa doesn’t willingly go with Little Finger is excellent. And Olenna doesn’t have the slightest hesitation in using her grandson for that purpose. I’m not sure what Varys gains by foiling LF’s plot. Does he truly think LF could end up commanding the northern forces? It seems preposterous. So I’m interested to see how this plays out.
Joffrey was good again this episode. I like the energy between him and Margaery. Margaery does what every young woman does, she pretends to be interested in whatever stupid thing her beau is going on about. But Margaery doesn’t do it because she’s a foolish infatuated child. She does it to wrap Joffrey around her finger and understand what makes him tick. I love the deliberateness in how she interacts with him. And the scene with the crowd is great. Margaery gives Joffrey the courage to face the crowd. Margaery literally opens new doors for Joffrey with her understanding of politics and leadership. He drinks up the adoration of the crowd and he knows who to thank for exposing him to this. She’s impressive…truly groomed to be a queen. And Cersei is left looking like a worrying fool. It's a good thing she didn't have the benefit of being raised a Tyrell.
Margaery’s scene with Sansa is such a contrast…she’s not as fake with Sansa as she is with Joffrey. Then again, I suppose she doesn’t need to be. She acts like a fun, carefree girl to gain Sansa’s confidence, and it seems natural and almost genuine. I loved the pig nose comment! So true, and such a clever way to disarm Sansa by putting her own insecurities on display. And I suppose I shouldn’t have been surprised that Margaery was the one to broach the subject of pairing her brother with Sansa, but I was. Poor Sansa is so sincere and foolish, she buys it completely. You can see her high hopes, and you know the poor naïve girl is going to get crushed under someone’s boot heel once again.
In the scene with Margaery, Joffrey, Cersei and Olenna, I didn’t realize at first who Olenna was. I thought Cersei was making wedding arrangements with a septa because Olenna's hair was covered. I didn’t realize until Margaery and Joffrey joined them that she was the Queen of Thorns. It was interesting that Olenna tried the same thing on Cersei that worked so well on Sansa…telling her what she wanted to hear. Yes, Olenna surely believes that women should be in charge, and knows that women go to great lengths to protect their non-warrior sons, but her statements were made with the intention of winning Cersei over. And Cersei, while charmed, had the sense to tread carefully with Olenna. Her reaction to Olenna's comments reminded me a little bit like Sansa, saying the words expected of her while not believing any of it.
I love the Tywin-Cersei scene. It mirrored the Tywin-Tyrion scene so closely that I expected Cersei to announce that she wanted Casterly Rock once Joffrey was married. Tywin was gentler with Cersei than with Tyrion, but it was good to see that he doesn’t seem to particularly favor any of his children when they challenge him. Cersei looked like she was about twelve years old sitting in that big chair, impatiently waiting on her father and ineptly trying to turn his sentiments against the Tyrells. Was it the conversation with Olenna that pushed Cersei to confront her father about her fitness as compared to her brothers? Perhaps Olenna’s words had more impact that I thought.
The Bran scene was interesting, but felt out of place in this episode. I guess it lets us know that even though we’re not seeing a lot of Bran, Jojen is training him to use his skills. When Jojen said “you know how,” I thought Bran would fly into the tree, not climb it. I don’t know why. I guess because it’s a dream, so why not? And Catelyn struck me as funny…almost a caricature of herself. I realized that this is how Bran sees her, not how she truly is. It was a short, but fun scene. But I think what I saw in Jojen's eyes at the end was disappointment.
Poor Theon! His would-be rescuer had me believing him as he painted the picture of Theon being taken away and of a possible rift between Balon and Yara. And then the boy started acting strangely as he took Theon through the passageways. I started wondering who truly had his loyalty. Theon’s confession about the boys and about Ned Stark being his true father was so gutwrenching. I felt for him, the poor misguided young man that he is. And then WTF!!?!? The betrayal was so stunning! I was absolutely shocked by the turn of events. I thought the boy might be loyal to Robb or some other faction, but I never dreamt he had led Theon in a big circle. (And Theon didn’t even notice. That’s the sad part.) I’m a bit confused by the boy killing the Bolton men last episode. I guess the purpose was to get Theon to trust him? I’m just not sure. Because I think the last man he killed was the guy who was torturing Theon, if I’m not mistaken. Regardless, Theon’s even more screwed now than before, if that’s possible. Bolton is turning into a power player, having both Jaime and Theon in his hands.
I had a tough time figuring out exactly what happened with the Night’s Watch this episode. I wasn’t sure how the dead guy on the funeral pyre could have died of starvation right after arriving at Craster’s Keep, but I guess the Night’s Watch brothers’ commentary was supposed to clue me in that they had been staying there for some time, and Craster hadn’t been overly generous in opening his larder. I don’t know why in a harsh place like Westeros, where principles mean so little, they didn’t just sweep Craster out of the way, wipe out his stocks and send Craster and his daughters scurrying south. That’s what armies do, and the deference Mormont showed Craster didn’t make sense given the current circumstances.
I watched the death scene a couple of times because it was overwhelming the first time through. It was much clearer once I saw it again and I could tell who was doing what. I liked the guy who killed Craster, Karl. “A daughter-fucking wildling bastard.” The setup for the stabbing was nicely handled. In fact, it was perfect. But then Karl threatened one of the daughters, and Rast stabbed Mormont, Grenn jumped on Karl and nobody jumped on Rast for stabbing Mormont. The melee that broke out didn’t make much sense, and as I said, I was confused about why everyone but Sam seemed to be fighting. I just thought “Noooo, someone killed the Lord Commander! Why is everyone fighting? WTF???" Whatever…maybe we’ll get some reasonable explanation at some point. Oh, and Grenn and Edd are starting to grow on me. I love their complaining. I have to admit that Sam isn’t growing on me at all.
The Brotherhood scenes were good. Last episode, for some reason I thought they took the Hound away, and Arya and the others were going somewhere different, so I was pleased that Arya and the Hound are still together. And she finally got to confront him about killing the butcher's boy. The Hound is fabulous in this scene. “You’re still swineherds.” I guess there are only two types of men in Westeros, killers and swineherds. He mounts a spirited defense of his actions or lack of actions. I’m glad it’s trial by combat and not burning him. Or will fire be involved? We all know how the Hound loves fire.
Beric Dondarrion was pretty decent. I wasn’t happy about the revelation that the Brotherhood are worshipers of the red god. So at some point these folks may end up siding with Melisandre and Stannis, That would make for an interesting twist. And they might have a penchant for burning people. Ugh.
Danaerys’ scenes were nicely orchestrated. It was entirely too predictable that she would double-cross Kraznys, but I still enjoyed it. I loved that she speaks Valyrian. She played Kraznys for a fool. I thought the fighting scenes were a little underwhelming. It could've been a bit less mechanical. I expected Dany to free all the other slaves, and they didn’t show that happen, even though I'm sure it did. But I was surprised and dismayed when Dany offered the Unsullied their freedom. I thought she was showing weakness, and it was a mistake. I don’t know whether it makes any difference other than in her own mind that she freed them. I guess we’ll find out. What I loved most about the scene, other than the Valyrian language, was Dany jumping on that white horse. It reminded me of her Dothraki days, and it was very fitting. My final thoughts were, now she’s got swagger. She’s finally come into her own. It was a nice ending to a good episode.
@Macha, if there's a tradition of guests and hosts being protected, then I can see a different dynamic in the Craster scenes. Even though Craster spends an awful lot of time threatening to chop people's parts off if that's the case. I wish they had explained it a bit more.
@Tir, I'm surprised by how similarly Mr. Tir and I think. We disagree completely on Jaime though. I believe he'll become a better person for his struggles, not a worse one. I'll be interested to see how it plays out.
The "Winter is Coming" line during Theon's rescue bothered me initially, but in the end I decided it was a clever way of saying that the northmen were hot on their heels. Mr. Tir's perceptions about the rescue were better than mine. I thought the rescuer probably wasn't one of Yara's man, but I figured that wherever he was taking Theon was better than where Theon just came from. The scene where the rescuer is fiddling with the lock, I knew something wasn't right, but I never suspected that they had returned to the Boltons' keep. The cruelty of that is overwhelming. It's truly the sort of thing that breaks a man's spirit. Poor Theon. I don't think he'll make it out of there alive.
I hadn't even thought about Gendry. He's such a follower. I hope he doesn't end up staying with the Brotherhood and their fire god. Ugh. Mr. Tir is giving me anxiety!
-- Edited by Black as Snow on Tuesday 23rd of April 2013 10:08:32 AM
I don’t know why in a harsh place like Westeros, where principles mean so little, they didn’t just sweep Craster out of the way, wipe out his stocks and send Craster and his daughters scurrying south. That’s what armies do, and the deference Mormont showed Craster didn’t make sense given the current circumstances.
Hmm, it appears that people complaining about the lack of emphasis on the guest right were onto something. I think Mormont or someone else mentions they'd be cursed if they draw out their swords or something in Craster's home? I'll have to check again. Perhaps that line should have been extended.
The reason why they don't wipe out Crasters stocks (to which they actually contributed over the years, or so I understood) is because of the guest right, which is or should be sacred in Westeros. When a guest eats and drinks something offered by the host, this "law" comes in effect, and none of them can harm the other without being cursed. So even though Craster ended up feeding them much less than they expected, they couldn't do anything about it - in theory.
Thank you ladies, I do like reading non reader reviews . It strangely reminds me of things I'd forgotten my self!
I was watching a history programme the other day about an large scale battle in Scotland . Seems the " hearth rites" were big in Scotland back in the day ..
Beric Dondarrion was pretty decent. I wasn’t happy about the revelation that the Brotherhood are worshipers of the red god. So at some point these folks may end up siding with Melisandre and Stannis, That would make for an interesting twist. And they might have a penchant for burning people. Ugh.
One point; Jaqen H'Ghar was a follower of the red god too. Rhllor is a pretty widespread religion, although not so much in Westeros.
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"There's no cure for being a cunt." Bronn "King Stannis is my god." Davos "Who the fuck is Jon Snow?" Locke
One point; Jaqen H'Ghar was a follower of the red god too. Rhllor is a pretty widespread religion, although not so much in Westeros.
Uhm, I don't think they mentioned this in the show but I got the impression that Jaqen follows The Many Faced God, of which R'hllor is only one aspect?
Last season, the show was completely unclear about whether Jaqen H'Ghar's red god and Mel's fire god were the same thing, so I didn't make any assumptions. But it was clear to me in this episode that Mel and the Brotherhood worship the same fiery fellow. What isn't clear is how or why a bunch of deserters (assuming that's what they are) ended up worshiping a foreign fire god.
What isn't clear is how or why a bunch of deserters (assuming that's what they are) ended up worshiping a foreign fire god.
Well Basi you have youself seen Mel conjure up a shadowdemon, and Jaquen killing and facechanging abilities are also linked to the Fire God, so when it comes down to religions where their worshipers actually coax tangeble results, the Red god seems to be in the lead.
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"Robert was never the same after he put on that crown. Some men are like swords, made for fighting. Hang them up and they go to rust.” -DN
Wait, wait. I'm gonna go slightly off-topic and go back to Jaqen - he mentions the Red God because when Arya saves him, she saves him from a fire. If she would have saved him from drowning, he would have told her that they owe the Drowned God one life, or two or three. So I don't think the Red God is particulary linked to face-changing, I think Jaqen worships a god (of Death?) that embodies all of the aspects of the other gods, since death is universal. At least that was my take on it.
I always remember strange things from the books and I think Macha is right here. It is the God of death, the many faces or whatever.
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"I´d not prolongued the chewing up, Doc. Nor the being spat out. Not go out a cunt. It´s the dispatch I find inglorious. The whole delusory fucking self importance.". Al Swedgin ;).
I think that will become clear as they go on Basi .
Thoros of course is from Myr
Oh duh! I didn't even snap to the fact that he was a foreigner. I just thought he had funny hair.
@Don, you're certainly correct about the tangible results. But those tangible results aren't necessarily visible to rank and file soldiers, so I didn't think of it as a factor.
@Don, correct about the tangible results. But those tangible results aren't necessarily visible to rank and file soldiers, so I didn't think of it as a factor.
Seeing is believing and like Yvy says and I agree, it will be made more clear.
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"Robert was never the same after he put on that crown. Some men are like swords, made for fighting. Hang them up and they go to rust.” -DN
And I just want to ask everyone... nobody mentioned the masquerade that was telling about. I TOTALLY CAME UP WITH THAT FOR THE FUNFICTION COMPLETELY ON MY OWN. D & D stole the idea from me. Fuckers.
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"There's no cure for being a cunt." Bronn "King Stannis is my god." Davos "Who the fuck is Jon Snow?" Locke
Well, it was a parade but it was also a masqued fete in conjunction with the tourney. I think we probably talked about that more on chat than anything else. I'm too lazy to browse the thread.
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"There's no cure for being a cunt." Bronn "King Stannis is my god." Davos "Who the fuck is Jon Snow?" Locke
catch me!
Go and die in a worm hole! 
scene with 
; I was totally blown away by how they portrayed it. Freaking awesome it was. Now... to make my :dracarys: animated emoticon...
! 
subtle scarf.
) He believed his speech in the woods about Saltpans and Balon and whatnot, but then on the corridor he said "this is a trap, Theon shut ur face and get out, it's a traaaaap".
The setup for the stabbing was nicely handled. In fact, it was perfect. But then Karl threatened one of the daughters, and Rast stabbed Mormont, Grenn jumped on Karl and nobody jumped on Rast for stabbing Mormont. The melee that broke out didn’t make much sense, and as I said, I was confused about why everyone but Sam seemed to be fighting. I just thought “Noooo, someone killed the Lord Commander! Why is everyone fighting? WTF???" Whatever…maybe we’ll get some reasonable explanation at some point. Oh, and Grenn and Edd are starting to grow on me. I love their complaining. I have to admit that Sam isn’t growing on me at all. 
was telling 
about. I TOTALLY CAME UP WITH THAT FOR THE FUNFICTION COMPLETELY ON MY OWN. D & D stole the idea from me. Fuckers. 
