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Topic: Season 5, book to screen discussion *spoilers OK!*

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DonalNoyesArm
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RE: Season 5, book to screen discussion *spoilers OK!*
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Rygar wrote:

 I did like.how Thorne showed Jon respect for leading. That seemed out of book charactet.

 Yeah, show Thorne is more of a hardass and less of a scheming asshole than his book counterpart. I like it.



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Rygar
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I do as well. Makes him less of your clichéd mean spirited villainous teacher/instructor. It gives the character some depth and realism.

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Cosca
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I don't really think they're showing her as a master playa. Lying to those Vale lords was easy. She's just more confident, she's not suddenly a genius.

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Rygar
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lol Cosca. You missed it.

It's more than confidence.   it's spite.  That girl is ppppooooiiiissssooooonnnn.



-- Edited by Rygar on Monday 20th of April 2015 08:31:43 AM

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Macha
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It's weird to say this, but suddenly Sansa's storyline is the one I'm most interested in this season. And if she's heading to Winterfell, and Brienne and Pod manage to stay on their trail, I can't wait to see the result!

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DonalNoyesArm
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Sansa has used her "I am a vulnarable, silly girl" a few times to her advantage.
During the "Lemoncake scene" last season with Aunt Lysa, and very well in the hearing with Lord Royce after Lysa's death.
That is her angle, she might expand on it this season, and it might even backfire, who knows. But it is a different kind of scheming and I would like to see it explored.

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Cosca
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But why would she ever be nice to Brienne? Or LF? The spite was justified there I think

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Rygar
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It could be Macha. But right now it is failing on an emotional level for me.


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Rygar
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She is Being spiteful to everyone. She has a chip on her shoulder all of.a sudden.

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Macha
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Yes, but I think the audience is already a bit jaded when it comes to her and this angle, so what I'm seeing now is that they're changing her character and, while I wouldn't say she's suddenly a player, she appears to be at the point where she could handle herself even without Littlefinger constantly watching her. She's more dignified, and I think that becomes her.
All in all, even if she'll be forced into another marriage/ alliance, I hope we won't have to get back to her crying and being abused by everybody, it would be very redundant.

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DonalNoyesArm
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Sansa has a bit of a naivete still, the same that her mother had "Lord Walder knew me since I was a little girl, he would never harm me", her new act can only get her so far and it could go either well, or badly for her...can't wait!

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Cosca
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Who is everyone? She's only talked to 3 people since her change, and she was quite courteous to Lord Royce. One of them was a complete stranger, the other a sneaky manipulative bastard.

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Macha
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Rygar wrote:

She is Being spiteful to everyone. She has a chip on her shoulder all of.a sudden.

 Hmm, yes I see what you're saying, although to me it doesn't look like she's spiteful. As Brienne said, she's just extremely wary of strangers and TBH, what LF said is very true of Brienne - she does have a bad resume when it comes to protecting people, at least that's what everybody can tell. So I wouldn't have expected Sansa to react differently.... she does appear a bit unforgiving tho, but maybe that will be useful to her in the North.



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DonalNoyesArm
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Brienne needs to stop thinking that simply telling the truth will get you results. She could've said "Rendly was killed by a assassin sent by Stannis", instead of her "killed by a shadow".

We know she tells the truth, but to others she is this odd, gangly,unhinged woman in armor that tells strange tales, if I were Sansa I would've been weary too!

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Rygar
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She has a look on her face like everyone just farted.

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Al Swearengen
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I agree with Ry, don't like the new sassy Sansa at all. BTW so much for all the secrecy, Brienne just blurted out to the whole tavern that Sansa Stark is alive and traveling with Littlefinger, might as well just ditch the hair dye now and stop pretending to be Petyr's niece.

That whole scene was so bad, it almost became as bad as Yara's prison breakout attempt. This whole notion of " Ooh I wonder what would happen if this person met this person" is going to become bothersome. Some characters are just better off not meeting each other.

Also Brienne can murk The Hound but has to scamper away from a few Vale soldiers biggrin

D & D's writing becomes so sloppy when the venture into fan fic territory. I just hope they don't fuck up Jaime like they're doing with Sansa.



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DonalNoyesArm
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Look at Olly during the election, he looked really concerned that Jon might be too wildling friendly. Methinks he might be the one to stab em, if he is gonna be stabbed this season.

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Rygar
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I think he felt bad that he killed his wildling lover.

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Dolan
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Al Swearengen wrote:

I agree with Ry, don't like the new sassy Sansa at all. BTW so much for all the secrecy, Brienne just blurted out to the whole tavern that Sansa Stark is alive and traveling with Littlefinger, might as well just ditch the hair dye now and stop pretending to be Petyr's niece.

That whole scene was so bad, it almost became as bad as Yara's prison breakout attempt. This whole notion of " Ooh I wonder what would happen if this person met this person" is going to become bothersome. Some characters are just better off not meeting each other.

Also Brienne can murk The Hound but has to scamper away from a few Vale soldiers biggrin

D & D's writing becomes so sloppy when the venture into fan fic territory. I just hope they don't fuck up Jaime like they're doing with Sansa.

 So she shoulda take on Littlefinger's entire retinue by herself? Gimme a break she's a great fighter but not immortal.



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Al Swearengen
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Dolan wrote:
Al Swearengen wrote:

 So she shoulda take on Littlefinger's entire retinue by herself? Gimme a break she's a great fighter but not immortal.

No, but considering the way D & D have built Brienne into this badass warrior who can kick anyone's ass, it is kinda preposterous that she'd cower from a handful of Vale soldiers.

She shouldn't even of been in that tavern in the first place.  It's too convenient for Brienne to bump into Arya and Sansa in the space of a couple episodes, Westeros has shrunk drastically over the seasons biggrin



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Dolan
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Agree about the excess of "fortunate" encounters. But you're making unrealistic demands about Brienne, she wanted Sansa to willingly accept her service, the moment Sansa denied her she tried to leave, 'cause if Sansa didn't want her there's no point in trying to take her by force. If she would take on Littlefinger's entire retinue and win, it would still be kidnapping, and she would probably have to murder Littlefinger in the process, now tell me how that scenario would look like from Brienne's perspective? It would completely defeat the purpose of her becoming a sworn sword, cause she would be just taking over Littlefinger's role as mentor, and that's clearly not what she meant to do.



-- Edited by Dolan on Monday 20th of April 2015 10:14:08 PM

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Macha
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Al Swearengen wrote:

No, but considering the way D & D have built Brienne into this badass warrior who can kick anyone's ass, it is kinda preposterous that she'd cower from a handful of Vale soldiers.

 It's not that she cowered, but she was in close quarters, outnumbered (take a look at the soldiers accompanying Sansa and LF as they leave, we're not talking about two or three), and in front of someone who refused her service.

I agree with Dolan, what was she supposed to do, try to kill everyone on the spot? That would have been risky for her in terms of combat, would have wrecked the place and in the end, accomplished nothing.



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TormundsWoman
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Al Swearengen wrote:

I'll take Brienne's wandering around arc than the shit we saw in episode 2. That was fucking dreadful. I really don't like what D & D are doing with Sansa, it has disaster written all over it.

Brienne/Sansa fan fiction aside I thought it was another solid episode.

 </p teehee Al, I thought exactly the same when I saw the Vale scenes. I don't know if it is the writing, or the Sansa 180 degrees change that feels unnatural. Or maybe it is the air of superiority that Sansa suddenly has. But it was all bad for me. Really just plain bad. I'm expecting a stellar plot to make up for this horseshit. The rest was ok. The Wall was quite awesome. The long winding of Sam putting together the LC nom got an nice streamlining that didn't feel forced. I liked that.



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DonalNoyesArm
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Methinks the plot maneuvering for Sansa/Brienne is necessary now to set them up for the mid-season shenanigans.
I think it is simply a necessity of the pace of the show, I hope it pays off. spank

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TormundsWoman
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I agree Don, it was a set up but everything about those fortunate-Brie-happens-to-be-bump/almost bump-into-Sansa felt cheap to me. I think they could have cut the first ep near miss if they knew they'll do the inn in the second ep. One happenstance is enough if you're playing coincidence meeting.

Also, how come the Vale in general feels so depopulated?! Those hills are supposed to swarm with clans teehee I just this same feeling like last season of general disregard toward Eyrie. What I mean is: remember when Lysa Arryn had an actual court, servants and retinue in season 1 as it was befitting a High Lord/Lady? Because somehow in S4 the castle was ghost town. It was: Robin, Lysa, LF and Sansa!

Anyway, I forgot to mention Meereen. I thought that's pretty neat writing. Dany is another Ned there minus swinging the sword. I kind of felt for her. They certainly got the "ruling Meereen is hard" that Martin wrote himself into in ADWD down quick.

I loved Braavos. That was a brilliant choice to make the KM have Jaqen H'ghar's face. Not sure how Melly Sanders, Beric Dondarrion and Thoros of Myr somehow disappeared from the list. Sid was saying it at WotW and I did notice myself only 4 names

Can't wait to see Jamie in Dorne. It should be fun.

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Al Swearengen
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Judging by the preview for ep 3 it really does look like LF is taking Sansa to Winterfell on some sort of mission. Which is so retarded, Petyr would never in a million years risk putting such a vital asset like her within a 100 miles of any Bolton.

 

facepalm16.gif



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DonalNoyesArm
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TormundsWoman wrote:

 I think they could have cut the first ep near miss if they knew they'll do the inn in the second ep. One happenstance is enough if you're playing coincidence meeting.

 I agree, one random meeting should've been enough.



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Macha wrote:

It's weird to say this, but suddenly Sansa's storyline is the one I'm most interested in this season. And if she's heading to Winterfell, and Brienne and Pod manage to stay on their trail, I can't wait to see the result!

 I'm totally down with this. I'm thrilled with the track Sansa is taking here. I can't wait to see what comes! 



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If they do with Sansa what many are suspecting, I can't help but wonder if that's D&D kind of fast-forwarding through all her Vale stuff to where she's going to end up in the books, anyway. That may sound like a crazy thought, and it may be a crazy thought, but it occurred to me a week or two ago, and it keeps popping back into my mind. Of course, we won't know until the next book comes out, and depending on how much stuff Sansa has to do, we may not even know until ADOS. Still, though, I don't think D&D would just pull that out of their asses. I think it is based on something which will eventually happen in the books.

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DonalNoyesArm
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Nymeria Warrior Queen wrote:

 I can't help but wonder if that's D&D kind of fast-forwarding through all her Vale stuff to where she's going to end up in the books, anyway......, I don't think D&D would just pull that out of their asses. I think it is based on something which will eventually happen in the books.

 Indeed, they know the endgame, and we do not. But what about other things? Like Jaime in Dorne? 



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Rygar
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Maybe Jaime is just dorny? it's been a while since he raped Cersei.

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I won't know what I think about Jamie in Dorne until I see it.  I mean, in some ways they are substituting one King's Guard going to get Myrcella for another, albeit sooner than in the books.  Like I said, though, I'll have to wait and see.  One thing I know I'm not going to miss is Arianne.  It does seem a bit strange to have Ellaria so angry, but I'm not so sure she won't come full-circle.  Another sort of wait and see thing.



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DonalNoyesArm
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I forgot the name of the knight that was supposed to rescue Myrcella, wait did that even happen? In any case I do remember Myrcella getting cut in the face, will the botched rescue make it in the show? Ohhh I hope so!

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Speaking of endgame, and maybe I should just start a thread about it, but I'll at least mention it here...

I've been thinking a lot about the White Walkers (calling them the Others makes me think too much of Lost) and Valyrian steel. It's believed Valyrian steel can be effective against the WW's. So, who has Valyrian steel swords? Jon Snow and Brienne (who has part of Ice reforged, and for some reason I keep thinking that will end up being important). We know there is the other half of Ice which was given to Jofferey, but I don't think we know what's happened to that...it may just be sitting around king's Landing. We also have Arthur Dayne's sword, Dawn, which, if I recall correctly was last seen at Starfall when Ned returned it, and Ashara killed herself.

Anyway, I'm not sure where I'm going with this, other than to think, if she survives, Brienne will be fighting the WW's with Oathkeeper, we're pretty certain Jon will, who else will, and are there any other Valyrian steel swrods, who has them, and what will happen to the two we know about (the other half of Ice and Dawn?

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Rygar
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It was a joke.

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I couldn't remember either, Donal, but I just looked it up...Ser Balon Swann.

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DonalNoyesArm
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Damn Nym, really fastforwarding there...I do think this is a great idea for a new thread. The show has only two seasons left so it might be easier to speculate that timeline than the pooks.

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Rygar
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Balon Swann. Under guise of bringing Doran the skull of Gregor.

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Rygar
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And I didn't need to look it up.

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DonalNoyesArm
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Thats the ticket, thanks Ry.

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Rygar
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Put that in your Pipe And smoke it. Rygar knows Something.


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DonalNoyesArm wrote:

Damn Nym, really fastforwarding there...I do think this is a great idea for a new thread. The show has only two seasons left so it might be easier to speculate that timeline than the pooks.

 Sorry.  I was thinking about it last week, then my mind drifted on to something else, and then it was brought to mind again by someone commenting on the awesomeness of Valyrian steel cutting right through the guy's sword (before Brienne stabbed him in the neck), and wanted to get it out there before I forgot, again. :)



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Rygar
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Yes but it.didn't cut thru Sandors sword.

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Rygar wrote:

And I didn't need to look it up.

 Well, aren't you just Mr. Fancy Pants. ;)



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Nymeria Warrior Queen
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Rygar wrote:

Yes but it.didn't cut thru Sandors sword.

 True, but she didn't have the same momentum (not on horseback against the Hound).  Anyway, I just mentioning that because it's the comment which brought the other stuff back to mind.



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Rygar
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Just saying that the Hound would have won if he wasn't wounded And if Legolas didnt shoot him with that arrow.

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hahaha...

And I agree, the Hound would have won were he not injured.

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Dolan
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I don't remember the Hound being wounded, he sure don't look like it:

 

Brienne kicked his ass.



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TormundsWoman
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I can't find the right thread but I know there was a discussion here if all three Sand Snakes are Ellaria and Oberyn's daughters as opposed to being half sisters as in the pooks (IT GOT TO ME TOO teehee). I was under the impression the show is making them all Ellaria's daughters by Oberyn. Apparently I'm not the only one.

www.blastr.com/2015-4-20/exclusive-alexander-siddig-ruling-dorne-game-thrones

The reporter and Siddig seem to confirm this. Anyway, it was a great interview. I know we only got a glimpse of Doran by he just feels like Doran. Awesome casting call.



-- Edited by TormundsWoman on Wednesday 22nd of April 2015 10:29:31 AM

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DonalNoyesArm
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They are half sisters in the show also, trust me, I have seen the fires.

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